The funny thing about living in VA (state-controlled stores) but so close to MD (Private stores) and DC (maybe no laws at all pertaining to liquor stores? Who’s asking? Are you a cop?) is that the simplest booze question can turn into a knockdown drag-out fight over which stores in which locality you should visit for which items. If you ever need to create a distraction so you can sneak out of a gathering of booze-folks, just ask “hey, where can I get a bottle of Buffalo Trace?” and the ensuing melee will be all the cover you need.
People have their stores for specific bottles, for sure. I'm relatively new to the area (lived here in college, but only moved back as an adult recently), and obviously nobody who knows where to reliably score stuff is forthcoming with that information to an outsider. Sorta like favorite swimming holes, I guess. Doesn't really matter to me, because like I wrote, I mostly just stick to EW BiB for price and convenience, but if I wanted to move up-shelf much, I think it'd get pretty annoying, and quick.
Re: MD being a non-control state, and so close — agreed. Frankly, having to compete with non-natives for Blanton's has completely redpilled me to the basic tenets of federalism. Repeal the Commerce Clause WHEN?!
One former coworker literally has a spreadsheet of what he buys where - it’s literally 30 stores across Va, DC & MD - and he’d rather take a punch than share it outside his closest friends. Fortunately I’m too basic for all that!
Living in a non-control state, this is why I stick to something I know (Woodford’s Reserve when it’s on sale at the local packie) or local (hello Berkshire Mountain Distillery)
Someone asked recently what their friend from New York should buy while in Louisville and several of us said VOB. You can't find it much outside KY and it's good and cheap.
I almost commented a minute ago in response to BeerNye to say that my go-to cheap bourbon is VOB! But yeah, there's been a few times I've been seated next to a bourbon aficionado on a plane and when they find out I live in Louisville, they ask what they should look for... my answer is usually "you probably know better than me"
VOB is also so solid. I don't have a trained palate, I don't know if it's like, technically excellent or anything, but also I don't particularly care. Bourbon ignorance is bliss!
I can get Buffalo Trace at Walmart for $25. That's good enough for me. I worked at a liquor store in northern AZ and got to see all of this stupidity. I once saw a bottle of Pappy 23 on the shelf in Newport Beach CA for $5,000.
With bourbon, it's amazing because it's all stuff I considered perfectly fine 10 years ago (Buffalo Trace is a great example, it was a mid-shelf bourbon I could always find at my not-especially-fancy Manhattan liquor store) and so I *know* it's not worth the price or chase now.
As far as palate goes, though, this tracks to my appreciation of wine: I don't want to learn so much about wine that I can't enjoy a $12 bottle of pinot noir
And it's not that people care about a niche subject and really get into it. I get that <gestures to 50 rugby jerseys in the attic>
It's that it's a physical thing involving your sense of taste and smell. Mine are terrible, so for people to be able to detect the differences enough to care is awesome and a very foreign concept.
Like I can tell scotch from not-scotch. But if you put 5 roughly equivalent liquors down and asked me, I'd be at a loss to describe what about them makes them different from the other 4.
I often tell the story that, in early 2010, I was visiting my then-girlfriend (now-wife) on an out-of-town gig on Valentine's Day. She liked bourbon, so I stopped into a liquor store and asked for a good bottle of bourbon--they suggested a $50 bottle, which sounded nice and pricey, so I bought it. We made Manhattans using the hotel coffee pot as a shaker, and loved them.
The bottle was Van Winkle 12 year, and last year I saw it on the shelf for $1200.
I'm sorry, I got a ton of enjoyment out of that bottle--but it was a $50 bourbon, because there's *nothing* that tastes worth $1200.
My dad tells the story of the time he was at the home of an old friend who he's done consulting work for over the years. The friend was (still alive but now retired) a corporate turnaround specialist - a company looking to go public would hire him as CEO, he'd whip everything into shape P&L-wise for a couple years, get equity in the company, and move on after the IPO. And at several of those stops that were in my dad's industry, he'd hire Stu as a consultant for whatever things that entailed. In any case, I've known the guy my entire life. Really nice guy for someone worth nine figures.
So anyways at one point, one of these companies happened to be in the KC area, which conveniently is near Lawrence, which is where Bud and Arlene live l. They're the reason I ended up at KU, actually. That's another story.
So Bud would invite my father over for dinner quite a bit. One night, they're sitting downstairs in the wine cellar lounge and Bud pulls a bottle of wine out of the Special Wine Area or whatever, mentions how special and rare and coveted this particular wine/vintage is, and pours my dad a glass.
After a toast, my father lifted the glass to drink it and promptly somehow managed to spill the entire glass down the front of his shirt. Wine everywhere. Bud was not angry, after all it was clearly an accident, and he and my dad have been friends for almost 50 years now. (Well, more like 30 at that point but whatever). But he did say, congrats Stu, you just poured $10,000 onto your shirt. The mind boggles.
Yeah man, the mind boggles alright. If I had nine figures, I'd like to think I would not sink that wealth in rare bottles of wine/bourbon/anything. I guess when I become rich and famous off that newsletter $$$, I'll come back to this comment section and let you know if my newfound wealth has changed my thinking on this at all.
The wild thing is that Bud bought all his cars at Budget or Enterprise when they came off of fleet, he drove a succession of Ford Taurii for like 20-odd years. Spending more on a bottle of wine than he spent on 20 years of cars just does not compute with me.
Yeah I absolutely don't begrudge people getting really into niche shit. That's fine! Hobbies are cool! What bugs me so much about taterism is that it's a zero-sum game, and they're playing it without sportsmanship. It's like juicing for an intramural softball game. You *could* do that. But you could also simply... not, man.
My dad recently got a "guy" with an in for Buffalo Trace (here in PA, near impossible to find near MSRP), gave me a bottle, asked what I thought, and unfortunately, I had to be honest and tell him I don't really get the hype. It's fine! It's good! But I don't need a fell off the truck bottle when I could just buy one of many other bottles at my state store that my stupid tongue likes as much or more.
I think what drives me crazy in all of this- people are paying for a label. I’ve had expensive bourbon that I was so-so about and cheap bourbon than I loved (shouts to Ancient Age for tasting like peanut brittle)- and it came down to personal preference more than the quality of the juice.
The best value I’ve consistently found is local distilleries- Baltimore Spirits Co makes an Epoch Rye and Bourbon that are incredible and like $50-60, and I don’t have to get trampled or win a lottery. (Also, their tour experience lets you blend your own bottle, and I cannot say enough positive things about that). Liquid Riot in Maine does an oat whiskey that was incredibly interesting. Not every small joint is worthwhile, but exploring the breadth of options is more interesting than hoarding Weller red label.
nice article! Yeah, the modern NASCAR isn't driving your car as fast as you can to get away from the revenuers, it's driving your SUV at 5 MPH across the legion bridge from Virginia to Maryland
I believe that's the standard price at any Walmart (I work p/t there now). Not saying they always have it though. I'm in Southwest AZ, on the Colorado River, but that's all I'm gonna say lol!
The funny thing about living in VA (state-controlled stores) but so close to MD (Private stores) and DC (maybe no laws at all pertaining to liquor stores? Who’s asking? Are you a cop?) is that the simplest booze question can turn into a knockdown drag-out fight over which stores in which locality you should visit for which items. If you ever need to create a distraction so you can sneak out of a gathering of booze-folks, just ask “hey, where can I get a bottle of Buffalo Trace?” and the ensuing melee will be all the cover you need.
People have their stores for specific bottles, for sure. I'm relatively new to the area (lived here in college, but only moved back as an adult recently), and obviously nobody who knows where to reliably score stuff is forthcoming with that information to an outsider. Sorta like favorite swimming holes, I guess. Doesn't really matter to me, because like I wrote, I mostly just stick to EW BiB for price and convenience, but if I wanted to move up-shelf much, I think it'd get pretty annoying, and quick.
Re: MD being a non-control state, and so close — agreed. Frankly, having to compete with non-natives for Blanton's has completely redpilled me to the basic tenets of federalism. Repeal the Commerce Clause WHEN?!
One former coworker literally has a spreadsheet of what he buys where - it’s literally 30 stores across Va, DC & MD - and he’d rather take a punch than share it outside his closest friends. Fortunately I’m too basic for all that!
[that meme with the two guys looking out the bus windows]
[sad guy: spreadsheet of 30 stores wherein to buy the most in-demand bourbons]
[smiling guy: this one has a horsey on the bottle]
[Perks up] Horsey? Horsey!
You say "former" coworker... did he get fired for working on his whiskey spreadsheet on company time?
I left that job but he’s still there. I’m not sure that him sampling his list on the job would get him in trouble. Solid, well-run place all around.
They've yet to come for the regular Old Forester and for that, I am relieved. High rye and 86 proof makes it the ultimate utility player, imo
I know. I'm like, afraid to talk about Old Fo too openly in mixed company.
If you aren’t on the Buffalo trace 90 day jail list you’re not tatering hard enough
I'm mostly against carceralism, especially as it intersects with commerce. [Stephen A. Smith voice] BUT!
Living in a non-control state, this is why I stick to something I know (Woodford’s Reserve when it’s on sale at the local packie) or local (hello Berkshire Mountain Distillery)
Me just now:
“Haha taters my fave topic”
“Cookbook knows about taters?”
“Oh!! Dave! I know Dave!!!”
(Hi Dave!!! -- Tracy @ EPR :) )
Oh man, real meeting of the minds here! Always nice to see an old friend in a new place.
Someone asked recently what their friend from New York should buy while in Louisville and several of us said VOB. You can't find it much outside KY and it's good and cheap.
I almost commented a minute ago in response to BeerNye to say that my go-to cheap bourbon is VOB! But yeah, there's been a few times I've been seated next to a bourbon aficionado on a plane and when they find out I live in Louisville, they ask what they should look for... my answer is usually "you probably know better than me"
VOB is also so solid. I don't have a trained palate, I don't know if it's like, technically excellent or anything, but also I don't particularly care. Bourbon ignorance is bliss!
1) superb read. Loved it.
B) “Tater” is such a funny word to call someone, I’m glad it has stuck.
III) Evan Williams White Label is also my cheap go-to bourbon.
Agreed, it's like the perfect low-stakes insult. Plus it's verging on onomatopoeic, which is a fun bonus.
I can get Buffalo Trace at Walmart for $25. That's good enough for me. I worked at a liquor store in northern AZ and got to see all of this stupidity. I once saw a bottle of Pappy 23 on the shelf in Newport Beach CA for $5,000.
Not to be a freak but... what Walmart?!
It is good that 15 years of EDSBS commentariat tater behavior got deleted by Coral
Sort of like burning the library at Alexandria, but in a good way
The whole fancy liquor subculture blows my mind.
I don't have the palate to appreciate it, nor the money to get there, so I'm just a-ok with my $12 bottle of Rondiaz poured into Dr. Thunder
With bourbon, it's amazing because it's all stuff I considered perfectly fine 10 years ago (Buffalo Trace is a great example, it was a mid-shelf bourbon I could always find at my not-especially-fancy Manhattan liquor store) and so I *know* it's not worth the price or chase now.
As far as palate goes, though, this tracks to my appreciation of wine: I don't want to learn so much about wine that I can't enjoy a $12 bottle of pinot noir
And it's not that people care about a niche subject and really get into it. I get that <gestures to 50 rugby jerseys in the attic>
It's that it's a physical thing involving your sense of taste and smell. Mine are terrible, so for people to be able to detect the differences enough to care is awesome and a very foreign concept.
Like I can tell scotch from not-scotch. But if you put 5 roughly equivalent liquors down and asked me, I'd be at a loss to describe what about them makes them different from the other 4.
I often tell the story that, in early 2010, I was visiting my then-girlfriend (now-wife) on an out-of-town gig on Valentine's Day. She liked bourbon, so I stopped into a liquor store and asked for a good bottle of bourbon--they suggested a $50 bottle, which sounded nice and pricey, so I bought it. We made Manhattans using the hotel coffee pot as a shaker, and loved them.
The bottle was Van Winkle 12 year, and last year I saw it on the shelf for $1200.
I'm sorry, I got a ton of enjoyment out of that bottle--but it was a $50 bourbon, because there's *nothing* that tastes worth $1200.
That wailing sound you hear is a million taters lamenting this disgraceful "waste" of Pappy.
My dad tells the story of the time he was at the home of an old friend who he's done consulting work for over the years. The friend was (still alive but now retired) a corporate turnaround specialist - a company looking to go public would hire him as CEO, he'd whip everything into shape P&L-wise for a couple years, get equity in the company, and move on after the IPO. And at several of those stops that were in my dad's industry, he'd hire Stu as a consultant for whatever things that entailed. In any case, I've known the guy my entire life. Really nice guy for someone worth nine figures.
So anyways at one point, one of these companies happened to be in the KC area, which conveniently is near Lawrence, which is where Bud and Arlene live l. They're the reason I ended up at KU, actually. That's another story.
So Bud would invite my father over for dinner quite a bit. One night, they're sitting downstairs in the wine cellar lounge and Bud pulls a bottle of wine out of the Special Wine Area or whatever, mentions how special and rare and coveted this particular wine/vintage is, and pours my dad a glass.
After a toast, my father lifted the glass to drink it and promptly somehow managed to spill the entire glass down the front of his shirt. Wine everywhere. Bud was not angry, after all it was clearly an accident, and he and my dad have been friends for almost 50 years now. (Well, more like 30 at that point but whatever). But he did say, congrats Stu, you just poured $10,000 onto your shirt. The mind boggles.
Yeah man, the mind boggles alright. If I had nine figures, I'd like to think I would not sink that wealth in rare bottles of wine/bourbon/anything. I guess when I become rich and famous off that newsletter $$$, I'll come back to this comment section and let you know if my newfound wealth has changed my thinking on this at all.
The wild thing is that Bud bought all his cars at Budget or Enterprise when they came off of fleet, he drove a succession of Ford Taurii for like 20-odd years. Spending more on a bottle of wine than he spent on 20 years of cars just does not compute with me.
Yeah I absolutely don't begrudge people getting really into niche shit. That's fine! Hobbies are cool! What bugs me so much about taterism is that it's a zero-sum game, and they're playing it without sportsmanship. It's like juicing for an intramural softball game. You *could* do that. But you could also simply... not, man.
Wait people chase after Buffalo Trace? The ones they serve in single bottles on United flights that is perfectly fine?
One and the same.
My dad recently got a "guy" with an in for Buffalo Trace (here in PA, near impossible to find near MSRP), gave me a bottle, asked what I thought, and unfortunately, I had to be honest and tell him I don't really get the hype. It's fine! It's good! But I don't need a fell off the truck bottle when I could just buy one of many other bottles at my state store that my stupid tongue likes as much or more.
I think what drives me crazy in all of this- people are paying for a label. I’ve had expensive bourbon that I was so-so about and cheap bourbon than I loved (shouts to Ancient Age for tasting like peanut brittle)- and it came down to personal preference more than the quality of the juice.
The best value I’ve consistently found is local distilleries- Baltimore Spirits Co makes an Epoch Rye and Bourbon that are incredible and like $50-60, and I don’t have to get trampled or win a lottery. (Also, their tour experience lets you blend your own bottle, and I cannot say enough positive things about that). Liquid Riot in Maine does an oat whiskey that was incredibly interesting. Not every small joint is worthwhile, but exploring the breadth of options is more interesting than hoarding Weller red label.
nice article! Yeah, the modern NASCAR isn't driving your car as fast as you can to get away from the revenuers, it's driving your SUV at 5 MPH across the legion bridge from Virginia to Maryland
I believe that's the standard price at any Walmart (I work p/t there now). Not saying they always have it though. I'm in Southwest AZ, on the Colorado River, but that's all I'm gonna say lol!